The FAA revealed today (January 14) that a Delta Air Lines flight and a United Airlines flight busted separation requirements on approach to Phoenix Sky Harbor Airport (KPHX) in Arizona, midday on January 11. The Delta Airbus A330-300 and the United Boeing 737-900ER were inbound from Detroit Metropolitan Wayne County Airport (KDTW) and San Francisco International Airport (KSFO), respectively. According to the FAA, “Both flight crews received onboard alerts that the other aircraft was nearby. Air traffic control issued corrective instructions to both flight crews.”
What are the Delta guys even thinking ? They’re given a runway on the other side of the airport and they just keep mindlessly heading south towards the parallel runway ? At some point you gotta intervene and ask ATC what the plan is because she obviously forgot to issue them approach clearance.
When ATC staffing is as bad as it is, horrible performance is more tolerated. Improve ATC staffing and there will be more flexibility to have standards. This controller didn’t seem to care that she put two together. I didn’t hear a traffic alert issued.
You nailed it. This hopefully will bring to light the inadequate controller staffing at major airports. More than once pilots have been blocked from getting confirmation on landing clearance because the tower controller is also working ground and clearance delivery. Maybe you can pull that off in Harrisburg or El Paso but not at one of the busiest airports in the country.
I guess not parallel runways at Sky Harbor. I was on a 737 landing at SFO last month and there was another 737 landing on the parallel runway to the right. We touched down at about the same time. When we left 2 weeks later we started our takeoff roll simultaneously with an Embraer on the right runway. I would imagine the onboard alerts were shouting profanities at that point, lol.
To increase ATC controllers would require increasing FAA/ATC budgets and it may be in the coming year(s), that funding may not be forth coming. To increase quality may require funding for better education and recruitment which again may not be forth coming.
I am curious if situational awareness is on the decline as technology enters the cockpit with a almost unconscious reliance, mayhap with younger pilots. Thinking back on the Houston incident with FedX and SW, the FedX pilot seemed aware the situation was getting very unclear and took action even before or as ATC realized what was happening and that was an older experienced pilot.
As I talk with a now retired airline captain (air frieght, DC-8s) this topic of Aviate crops up. “Stick and Rudder” skills seem less emphasized then data management for when I watch a you tube video on aviation incidents, more times the situation is made worse because Aviate, “fly the plane” is overwhelmed by data condensed on one flat screen and/or an over reliance of checklists (yes, they are important, but as noted with USAirways 1549, Sully turned on the APU instead of waiting on the checklist).
I am truly curious as to thoughts of other experienced pilots. In training and recurrent, should there be scenes where the pilot is forced back to “fly the plane” because the data does not make sense.
(As I write I am reminded of an amazing example of this with the DC-10 crash where the pilots had to literally figure out how to fly the crippled plane or the one in Spain where the control lines were reversed and the pilots somehow figured out how to keep it in the air long enough to figure out how to fly it AND get it safely on the ground).
Yes, PHX has parallels. Runway 8 is north of both 7L and 7R. See the airport diagram here: https://aeronav.faa.gov/d-tpp/2413/00322AD.PDF Two aircraft taking off on parallels will not activate TCAS, which is set up for impending closure or intercepting courses. If, after departure, one flies towards the other, then the alarms will sound fairly quickly.
You’re correct, she apparently didn’t catch the impending loss of separation. I didn’t hear the TCAS alert going off in the background either. Once the aircraft respond to an RA, a traffic alert is pointless and just extraneous noise in the cockpit as the crews are required to follow the RA. Correct me if that’s changed, it’s been a few years since I was controlling traffic.
Where are you getting the idea that Runway 8 is on the other side of the airport? Runway 8 is north of both Runway 7L and 7R, where UAL is going. Do you have more info than the YouTube video, which only mentioned Runway 8 with DAL1070? Your point about asking for the approach clearance is valid since they’re about to overly the final, but their runway is north.
Correct runway 8 is the north complex. On the YouTube video I saw Delta was being vectored for 8. What’s Delta doing on the SOUTH side of 8 final approach course about to cross the final approach course of 7 ???
Because the controller forgot to turn Delta towards the runway or ask if it’s in sight for the visual. Either way, lack of situational awareness and timeliness led to the “deal.”
By all rights, all three runways should be 8s - i.e., 8L, 8C and 8R, based on their magnetic headings. The greater proximity of 7L and 7R should be apparent to all airline pilots, only aircraft not on IFR approaches might be confused, and tower operators aware of possible confusion, as it seems to me. And the same of course applies to 26, 25R and 25L.
No, I think the claim that newer pilots lack stick and rudder skills and over-rely on automation is a trope to nostalgia. If you go back to the early 60’s you find the skippers that came up through piston aircraft unable to check out on jets. If anything newer pilots have only a rote level of systems knowledge mostly because there is less interaction with systems on Airbus-style automated aircraft. But that comes with time, study and experience.
That would be worse. It would be better to flex a little on the exact runway magnetic direction and label the PHX parallel runways 7,8,9 for simplicity with the exact direction charted.